Partizan and Zvezda World Class Revival [Archive]

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PartizanBeograd

01-07-2005, 03:27 PM

I think the Partizan and Zvezda will soon be revived to world class teams, because this is the first time, since the break up of SFRJ, that both teams havent cashed in their talent.

Partizan have all ready gone furthur than any Former Yugo. They made the champions league last yr, being undefeated at home. But they had by far the hardest group in the champions league- Porto=Uefa Champions league winners, Real Madrid=stacked with world class talent, Marseille=Uefa cup runners up.
And this yr they made it to the spring, something that a former yugo team hasent done since the break up.

Zvezda- although it was a terrible defeat to PSV(0-5), they did still beat them at Beograd. But Zvezda is a very very young team, the average age is like 23. But they had very good talent, and if they dont sell anymore star players(like they did with vidic and mladenovic), in a couple of yrs, they can go as far as Partizan did have, probably even furthur all they need is a few more yrs of expierence

LopuZa

01-07-2005, 05:42 PM

I think the Partizan and Zvezda will soon be revived to world class teams, because this is the first time, since the break up of SFRJ, that both teams havent cashed in their talent.

Partizan have all ready gone furthur than any Former Yugo. They made the champions league last yr, being undefeated at home. But they had by far the hardest group in the champions league- Porto=Uefa Champions league winners, Real Madrid=stacked with world class talent, Marseille=Uefa cup runners up.
And this yr they made it to the spring, something that a former yugo team hasent done since the break up.

Zvezda- although it was a terrible defeat to PSV(0-5), they did still beat them at Beograd. But Zvezda is a very very young team, the average age is like 23. But they had very good talent, and if they dont sell anymore star players(like they did with vidic and mladenovic), in a couple of yrs, they can go as far as Partizan did have, probably even furthur all they need is a few more yrs of expierence

I am not disagreeing with all of this just like to correct you on this one item, ONLY Crvena Zvezda has gone further, that is it has won European Championship, the only club to win or go that far in any European competitions from the former Yugoslavia.

Natasa

01-07-2005, 05:47 PM

I also agree with you. But Zvezda has gone much farther then Partizan ever has.

PartizanBeograd

01-07-2005, 07:20 PM

LopuZa

01-07-2005, 07:51 PM

it is true, but that was in the past (former Yugoslavia)
what i was referring to was after the split up and war, i believe Partizan has out performed zvezda on the international level

btw Partizan was Runner up once :p

No, sorry Partizan has not outperformed Crvena Zvezda factually speaking Zvezda has reached more finals then Partizan, has won more domestic cup’s then Partizan…sorry Parti but fact is Crvena Zvezda is much better club then Partizan, while part of Yugoslavia and as part of SCG. Now, one can look at this in a positive way, in the long run this is good for SCG football, competition is healthy, and some day perhaps Partizan can win a European tournament. Unfortunately it can’t do it with Serbian and Montenegro players only, as Crevena Zvezda did in 1991/92, since it is relying heavily on foreign players.

serb01

01-10-2005, 12:47 AM

ur such a **** partizanbeograd lol..just hack it mate..zvezda r better than partizan..and in that psv game i think it was 1-0 then we recieved a red card and thats when the flood gates opened my friend..mladenovic was like 28yrs old so it was time to go and experience football elsewhere but shame about the others i know..hopefully this new chairman wont do any stupid things for us..but all in all zvezda r better than partizan in football sorry mate :D

Gennadios

01-10-2005, 12:52 AM

PFC

01-10-2005, 05:18 AM

No, sorry Partizan has not outperformed Crvena Zvezda factually speaking Zvezda has reached more finals then Partizan, has won more domestic cup’s then Partizan…sorry Parti but fact is Crvena Zvezda is much better club then Partizan, while part of Yugoslavia and as part of SCG. Now, one can look at this in a positive way, in the long run this is good for SCG football, competition is healthy, and some day perhaps Partizan can win a European tournament. Unfortunately it can’t do it with Serbian and Montenegro players only, as Crevena Zvezda did in 1991/92, since it is relying heavily on foreign players.

Sorry, but you have no idea what you're talking about..What he said was right, since the split up and new country Partizan has been more successful.. Domestic titles, European advancements and international rankings, among other things, prove this.. Zvezda were the better side in the B.C. years, I'll give you that, not like in the year 2004 that means much to me anyways ;)

serb01

01-10-2005, 08:10 AM

lol lopuza please write somethign fat against this argument lol..if partizan didnt make the champions league last yr none of u would b saying this which all of a sudden makes u guys top shit..we have both been very consistant in the uefa cup aswell so i dont c where ur advantage comes from? and id have to say id prefer zvezdas home record in the league and in europe than partizans..:p

LopuZa

01-10-2005, 05:30 PM

Sorry, but you have no idea what you're talking about..What he said was right, since the split up and new country Partizan has been more successful.. Domestic titles, European advancements and international rankings, among other things, prove this.. Zvezda were the better side in the B.C. years, I'll give you that, not like in the year 2004 that means much to me anyways ;)

Oh I bag to differ on this; it is you that have no clue what you are talking about, you are biased. Since the split of Yugoslavia Partizan has been more successful only in domestic titles and it has been alleged that Partizan was rigging crucial games, it appears that Partizan enjoyed Milosevic’s favor. Now let’s look at the records of both clubs since 1990/91, and see what the results tell us…

<pre>
1990/91 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1991/92 Crvena zvezda Beograd [4]
1992/93 Partizan Beograd
1993/94 Partizan Beograd
1994/95 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1995/96 Partizan Beograd
1996/97 Partizan Beograd
1997/98 FK Obilic
1998/99 Partizan Beograd [5]
1999/00 Crvena zvezda Beograd
2000/01 Crvena zvezda Beograd
2001/02 Partizan Beograd
Serbia and Montenegro (since February 2003)
2002/03 Partizan Beograd
2003/04 Crvena zvezda Beograd
</pre>

http://www.rsssf.com/tablesj/joegchamp.html

The Conclusion is that if we take a time slice 1990/91 to 2003/04 of both teams title runs in post Yugoslavia (SFRJ) we have that Partizan has one title more then Crvena Zvezda, wow that is huge edge.

Let me get this straight you think you can conveniently take a particular period of time that shows Partizan with a slight edge and call Partizan the better side because of this…sorry that is not how people compare a club greatness…they look at the whole picture, all the results, all domestic results, all European results, etc., that is how it is done. All the rest is irrelevant, and subjective. Bottom line as I have said before until Partizan wins a European title it will never be as good as Crvena Zvezda. Partizan needs to win any European tournament with Serbian and Montenegro players not imported players. We need to compare results objective way…keeps that in mind before you start telling everyone how great Partizan is, when it is not, if we look at all its results.

Oh and yes Partizan is gaining on Crvena Zvezda in international club rankings, first time since the creation of both clubs. But I can’t see how it will catch up since it never won any European cups. Crvena Zvezda has ranked above all former Yugoslavian clubs for the last 40 some years; keep that in mind when you are talking about that ranking.

<h3>European Clubs Ranking</h3>
<h4>The all-time table (from 1955/56 to 2003/04)</h4>
<pre>
AP d MP W D L gf ga gd B Pts
1.Real Madrid CF Esp 47 - 368 209 65 94 777 401 +376 86 569
2.FC Barcelona Esp 46 3 373 203 83 87 737 402 +335 73 562
3.Juventus FC Ita 43 - 334 189 65 80 606 307 +299 68 511
4.FC Bayern München Ger 36 - 294 160 72 62 562 296 +266 64 456
5.Internazionale FC Ita 40 2 281 138 69 74 440 257 +183 50 395
6.Milan AC Ita 34 - 260 138 60 62 434 229 +205 53 389
7.RSC Anderlecht Bel 44 - 280 140 54 86 490 348 +142 39 373
8.AFC Ajax (Amsterdam) Ned 40 1 245 133 45 67 441 222 +219 46 357
9.SL Benfica Por 43 1 253 121 63 69 448 266 +182 44 349
10.Liverpool FC Eng 31 1 223 125 50 48 413 183 +230 40 340
11.Manchester United FC Eng 27 - 212 111 58 43 404 213 +191 40 320
12.FC Porto Por 42 1 243 114 50 79 365 261 +104 30 308
13.Rangers FC (Glasgow) Sco 43 4 240 109 50 81 387 305 +82 25 293
14.Valencia CF Esp 28 - 204 104 52 48 354 215 +139 30 290
 15.FK Crvena Zvezda Beograd Smo 42 2 229 109 46 74 426 287 +139 24 288
16.FC Dynamo Kyiv Ukr 33 2 214 103 47 64 330 224 +106 29 282
17.Celtic FC (Glasgow) Sco 39 4 215 110 37 68 375 213 +162 24 281
18.Feyenoord (Rotterdam) Ned 34 2 200 94 51 55 345 230 +115 25 264
19.Club Atlético de Madrid Esp 33 - 184 101 30 53 316 201 +115 30 262
20.PSV Eindhoven Ned 35 3 204 85 49 70 334 231 +103 28 247
21.AS Roma Ita 27 - 184 88 43 53 273 171 +102 23 242
22.Spartak Moscow Rus 30 2 188 90 37 61 297 233 +64 18 235
23.Club Brugge KV Bel 32 4 185 86 31 68 306 239 +67 17 220
24.1. FC Köln Ger 25 - 160 84 29 47 310 186 +124 20 217
25.Borussia Dortmund Ger 20 3 157 80 29 48 249 178 +71 27 216
...
39.Dinamo Zagreb Cro 34 3 154 58 39 57 228 186 +42 12 167
...
41.HNK Hajduk (Split) Cro 29 1 138 62 27 49 209 157 +52 10 161
...
61.FK Partizan (Beograd) Smo 28 2 125 50 21 54 202 188 +14 7 128
</pre>

http://www.geocities.com/jfaugeras/uefaallt2004.html

PFC

01-10-2005, 09:17 PM

PFC

01-10-2005, 09:23 PM

Oh and one more thing..

alleged that Partizan was rigging crucial games, it appears that Partizan enjoyed Milosevic’s favor.

And this is the point at which me taking you seriously stops.. And yet you claim I am biased.. ;)

Kezman9

01-10-2005, 09:32 PM

Which team did better after the plit of yugoslavia dosnt matter , all that matters is the over all proformance, and zvezda had done much better, plus they won the european cup in 1991, so that beats all. i personaly like partizan (cuz thats kezmans old team) but im not into the serbian club teams. but i can admit zvezda has done better threw out time.

PartizanBeograd

01-11-2005, 03:00 AM

OMG are serbs actually getting dumber, do ppl even read the news, do ppl even know what is happening. I feel like PFC is the only person that knows anything about football
Partizan made it to the champsion league last yr, they had the by far the toughest group in the League(Madrid (stacked), Porto (winners), Marsille (Cup runner ups)) and still they managed to play with respectable scores and undefeated at home.
They made it to the spring this season in the UEFA cup, of which they are the only team to do so in the entire Former Yugo.
Zvezda's record since the split cannot even compare.
Even when Zvezda played in the UEfa cup they were never reached the second round, and this yr (although i was cheering for them to make it) they got hammer by PSV and Zenit( Zenit didnt even make it to the next round). I bet if u ask a young European fan, where Crvena Zvezda is from, they wouldnt know, cause Zvezda is not a big club anymore. Only older ppl would know

PartizanBeograd

01-11-2005, 03:03 AM

serb01

01-11-2005, 08:35 AM

Oh btw, if the game ended up being 1-0 for PSV, PSV would still qualify for the champions league, becuase they scored 2 goals in Beograd "mate"

hahaah he got red carded in like the 15th minute "mate" whos to say the score would have stayed at 1-0? ur an idiot pls..when you look at a club you look at its whole history not results in the last 10 yrs which makes partizan "so ***king magnificent" u all up urselves "mate" until u WIN a european competition u guys are NOT PROVEN r u that thick?? seriously when u win the champions league give me a msg and i will acknowlage your achievement but untill then just shut the fvck up..u made the champions league last season and all of a sudden u all think ur mad now hahaha bro..pls..win the champions league and ill say that ur just as good as we are..after all i c 2 stars above zvezdas emblem :smoking:

PartizanBeograd

01-11-2005, 07:00 PM

LopuZa

01-11-2005, 07:56 PM

No, I beg to differ it is you that obviously has no clue still what you are writing about.. The new country, if you didn't know, was formed in the season of 92/93. Thus the two RS titles (90/91, 91/92) you indicated do not count because they occured BEFORE the split up. Partizan then have THREE more titles, which if you ask me is a lot considering that we are only talking about a time period of 10 years.

Oh I see let’s play games, count what ever it takes to prove your point of view, ok. Even if we use your time slice THREE titles is nothing compared to the overall 28 title’s Crvena Zvezda won while the club was part of Yugoslavia as well as part of SCG…and other achievements that can’t be removed in order to show Partizan is a greater club then Crvena Zvezda. You are desperate to show and prove something that you can not show or prove no matter how you slice it. Live with it Crvena Zvezda is a better club, taking slices of time to show that Partizan won more titles in that time slice is irrelevant, when compared with all the results of Crvena Zvezda since the clubs creation in 1945.

What the hell are you talking about? I agree your overall history is richer (no doubt) but greatness of a club is NOT looked up on purely on it's past achievements of some 50 years ago.

Look at Nottingham Forrest for instance, they won the European Crown twice now they are bankrupt and no-where. While a club like Arsenal haven't won the CL, I'm sure you'd agree they are a bigger club? Heck, Zenit never came close to a European championship yet they spanked you 6-1.

My point is, what you accomplished happened a long time ago and has very little influence on today. Your trophy in Bari realistically means next to nothing for you at the moment. You're bankrupt, your club is in complete dissaray and constantly looking to sell more of its' best players. Wake up, today the year is 2004, not 1991.

No, no what the hell are you talking about? Let me get this straight Crvena Zvezda’s history is richer but the greatness of a club is not looked at purely on its past achievements of some 50 years ago. Problem with that statement is that it has only been 15 years since Crvena Zvezda won the European Champions' Cup Winner (season 1990/91), and Intercontinental "Toyota Cup", clubs biggest achievements. This achievement is the greatest achievement that any club from former Yugoslavia ever achieved; mind you Crvena Zvezda did it with all domestic players’ not foreign talent.

Look bankruptcy can happen to any club; but it does not diminish the clubs past achievements, or greatness. Yes, Arsenal is a bigger club but it has nothing to do with Partizan or Crvena Zvezda. Heck as for Zenit that has never won the European championship but managed to spank Crvena Zvezda’s youngest team ever by the score of 6-1, is once again a great achievement for Zenit, let them enjoy it. I do remember a game in 1997/98 when Partizan played vs. Croatia Zagreb it got whooped by the score of 5-0, and the goalie was none other then Ivica Kralj and the players were some of the best players Partizan had; mind you this was not youth team or a team that was being rebuilt.
No, not at all what Crvena Zvezda accomplished in 1990/91 was only 15 years ago, and not a very long time when you are an adult, on the other hand for a child 15 years is a life time. The 3 titles that Partizan won in that time slice you concentrated on 1992-2005 means next to nothing when compared with the achievements like the European Champions' Cup (1991/92) as well as well as Intercontinental "Toyota Cup" (1991/92) is an achievement that Partizan will never achieve any time soon, and definitely not with SCG players only. You have a dream, good luck achieving it.

Crvena Zvezda is not bankrupt, it sold players when it needed money, I never agreed with that philosophy that is why Dragan Djaic resigned. Perhaps you forgot but Partizan practiced the same philosophy and sold its best players when it needed to during the civil war years. This year Crvena Zvezda did not sell any players, Partizan did. And I am sorry that Crvena Zvezda is a better club then Partizan, I am also sorry for 1991 since Partizan will never achieve anything like it any time soon. Today is January 11 2005, but what the hell I knew you are not very bright considering that you can’t even get the year right.

No, I wasn't reffering to this ranking because it means next to nothing. I was talking about UEFA's ranking which determines the seeds and status of clubs in competitions TODAY.

This is how things stand..

80 Partizan Belgrade Srb 2.485 3.045 6.595 5.485 8.072 25.682
103 Red Star Belgrade Srb 6.485 2.045 5.595 5.485 1.072 20.682

http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/trank2005.html

The difference will only get bigger at the end of the season because it is a system that includes the results for clubs within the last 5 years, each time taking away the points of the fifth year (and as you can see, in that year Red Star had more points).. This is the ONLY ranking system that matters and is the ONLY one used by Uefa for the CL, Uefa Cup seeds and so forth.

The table you brought up looks nice and has you high up there, but really is of no significance.

We have establish that any ranking that shows Crvena Zvezda as a better club then Partizan means next to nothing, ok your honest opinion, no problem. As long as Crvena Zvezda keeps wining domestic titles it will get chances to play in European cups, this means that it will be ranked according to its achievements, as has been done throughout the years, nothing new to me. The table I brought up is an all time table which has more significance and does not exclude past achievements, it includes all achievements, and it does not take things out of context as you have attempted but failed to do. Cheers.

LopuZa

01-11-2005, 08:13 PM

Oh and one more thing..

And this is the point at which me taking you seriously stops.. And yet you claim I am biased.. ;)

The allegation of fixing games was brought up this year once again, and it always involves Partizan…One of the titles that Partizan won was taken back and awarded to Crvena Zvezda then it was given back to Partizan, again all under suspicious circumstances. I wonder why these allegations are coming out if there are no merits to the allegations. Anyways I posted the article dealing with this subject in the 1. Liga thread…

LopuZa

01-11-2005, 08:23 PM

OMG are serbs actually getting dumber, do ppl even read the news, do ppl even know what is happening. I feel like PFC is the only person that knows anything about football
"snip"

It can't be true that all of us Serbs are getting dumber; could it be that two of you are getting dumber, and thus you agree with each other so well. Of course PFC is the only person that knows anything about football; after all he agrees with you on all points which make sense from your point of view.

LopuZa

01-11-2005, 08:38 PM

than what about the Zenit game, Zenit is a shit team
why were u hammered 0-4, and at least u could of won at home but no u lost again 1-2, dude u cant win this conversation. Zvezda is a team in the past.
they are joining the list of former greats
-CSA Steaua Bucuresti
-Hamburger SV
-Nottingham Forest FC
-Crvena Zvezda (newest arrival)

All these teams were once were big clubs, but now they are very small incomparison to their glory days

Well then one could also say that Croatia Zagreb was a shit team, why was Partizan hammered 5-0, this was not a youth team but rather a team made up of great veterans…like Ivica Kralj, etc.

Crvena Zvezda is not a club of the past, but it has a great past which will insure that it will have a great future. There is one thing that the list of former greats has and that is that they are all winners of European Cups, something that Partizan will never accomplish…

PFC

01-12-2005, 01:45 AM

Ok, one by one now I'll answer to your above "post".. Make sure to have a pen and paper close to you because this is the only time I'll be giving you lessons for free.

Oh I see let’s play games, count what ever it takes to prove your point of view, ok. Even if we use your time slice THREE titles

No, we are not playing games it's just that you had no clue what you were saying. We were discussing the post-Ex. Yu period and your list was therefore wrong because it included two years which happened with the OLD COUNTRY. It' quite simple, you were wrong and I corrected you. If anything you were twisting info to suit your non existent points.

nothing compared to the overall 28 title’s Crvena Zvezda won while the club was part of Yugoslavia as well as part of SCG…and other achievements that can’t be removed in order to show Partizan is a greater club then Crvena Zvezda. You are desperate to show and prove something that you can not show or prove no matter how you slice it. Live with it Crvena Zvezda is a better club, taking slices of time to show that Partizan won more titles in that time slice is irrelevant, when compared with all the results of Crvena Zvezda since the clubs creation in 1945.

This just shows again how little you know. Buddy, you don't even know the amount of titles you club has, yet you are vigirously arguing with me here. Let me help you, it's 25 not 28. Who the heck am I arguing with here when then don't even know such basic data. :confused: I never took away from RS's history and I believe I said it's bigger, however at the same time you can not only depend on history and not care about the present at all.. I would much rather be fan of a club that is winning today and doing well in Europe as opposed to one that died in 1991. Besides, what do you have of RS's success from 40-50 years ago? I have a feeling that you were born in the generation of people which started following matches in the mid 90's. Let me bring up Zenit again as an example, a club with almost NO history, however beat you on aggregate 6-1. Tell me, what do you have of this history then?

No, no what the hell are you talking about? Let me get this straight Crvena Zvezda’s history is richer but the greatness of a club is not looked at purely on its past achievements of some 50 years ago. Problem with that statement is that it has only been 15 years since Crvena Zvezda won the European Champions' Cup Winner (season 1990/91), and Intercontinental "Toyota Cup", clubs biggest achievements. This achievement is the greatest achievement that any club from former Yugoslavia ever achieved; mind you Crvena Zvezda did it with all domestic players’ not foreign talent.

A club that has gone silent for 15 years and done nothing on an international stage since then CANNOT be labelled as great. Real Madrid, Man UTD, Bayern etc. these are great clubs because they are consistent and always good. You on the otherhand are a one hit wonder, just like Nottingham Forest you had your 2 minutes of fame and now who knows when you'll be important again. That my friend is what separates GREAT clubs from just average, ordinary ones. By the way, again you make a false statement. Red Star did not do it with "all" domestic players, such a statement is ridicilous. They did it with Croatian, Macedonian, Romanian etc. players along with Serbian. Yes, the Serbian players were the majority, but players like Prosinekci, Pancev, Belodedici among other non-Serbian players, all played a heavy role in RS's success in 1991.

Look bankruptcy can happen to any club; but it does not diminish the clubs past achievements, or greatness. Yes, Arsenal is a bigger club but it has nothing to do with Partizan or Crvena Zvezda. Heck as for Zenit that has never won the European championship but managed to spank Crvena Zvezda’s youngest team ever by the score of 6-1, is once again a great achievement for Zenit, let them enjoy it. I do remember a game in 1997/98 when Partizan played vs. Croatia Zagreb it got whooped by the score of 5-0, and the goalie was none other then Ivica Kralj and the players were some of the best players Partizan had; mind you this was not youth team or a team that was being rebuilt.

This is where I dozed of, what exactly were you trying to say? Do try harder next time please, and maybe you'll actually make some sense.

Crvena Zvezda is not bankrupt, it sold players when it needed money, I never agreed with that philosophy that is why Dragan Djaic resigned. Perhaps you forgot but Partizan practiced the same philosophy and sold its best players when it needed to during the civil war years. This year Crvena Zvezda did not sell any players, Partizan did. And I am sorry that Crvena Zvezda is a better club then Partizan, I am also sorry for 1991 since Partizan will never achieve anything like it any time soon. Today is January 11 2005,

Again I fell asleep reading this as well. You just keep making one flawed statement after another. First of all, you can not even compare Partizan's handling of the club with that of Red Star's. Partizan has for the most part held intact it's squad during the last number of years while RS is changing whenever possible. Partizan also have Teleoptik, a top class training facility among the best in Europe. Partizan have invested in the foreign market and signed players from abroad which ended up doing more than just good (Boya, Emeghara etc.).. Partizan's youth school has developed unbelievably in these last few years and beats your young team just about every time. Now my friend, Red Star have NONE of those things I listed. By the way, i just love your first sentence, if your club is not bankrupt then tell me why does your only source of revenue come from selling players? Do you realize what you said? Also, RS didn't sell any players? What the heck are you smoking man? YOU SOLD YOUR TWO BEST PLAYERS IN VIDIC AND MLADENOVIC! Again I have to correct you.

We have establish that any ranking that shows Crvena Zvezda as a better club then Partizan means next to nothing, ok your honest opinion, no problem. As long as Crvena Zvezda keeps wining domestic titles it will get chances to play in European cups, this means that it will be ranked according to its achievements, as has been done throughout the years, nothing new to me. The table I brought up is an all time table which has more significance and does not exclude past achievements, it includes all achievements, and it does not take things out of context as you have attempted but failed to do. Cheers.

No, we have established that you're a stubborn young kid that has very little idea of what they are saying. I posted the only ranking which matters, the only ranking that is USED BY UEFA. All other tables (like the one you listed) are useless since they are officially not used or recognized by UEFA, the clubs, associations etc. Do you understand now?

The allegation of fixing games was brought up this year once again, and it always involves Partizan…One of the titles that Partizan won was taken back and awarded to Crvena Zvezda then it was given back to Partizan, again all under suspicious circumstances. I wonder why these allegations are coming out if there are no merits to the allegations. Anyways I posted the article dealing with this subject in the 1. Liga thread

Yes, fixing games was brought up this year.. but it involved Red Star as well, not just Partizan. In fact Red Star was PUBLICLY attacked by some heads in FSSCG while Partizan was more-or-less brought up through random rumours about a ref's decision on a penalty call. Interestingly, in that same match a sure penalty was not given to Partizan, so much for us rigging matches. :rolleyes: Also, for the 100th time, you're wrong on something. No title was ever taken away from RS, it was taken away from Vardar in '87 and given justily to Partizan. Don't talk about things you don't know.

Of course PFC is the only person that knows anything about football; after all he agrees with you on all points which make sense from your point of view.

No, PFC does not know everything. But I sure as hell know more than you, that much I think I have proven..:)

PFC

01-12-2005, 01:48 AM

I just saw this and I had to comment..

this was not a youth team but rather a team made up of great veterans…like Ivica Kralj, etc

You see, that happened almost 8 years ago and back then Kralj was anything but a veteran :D Oh btw, it was a youth team and actually nothing even close to resembling a veteran team. Again, check your info before posting, so you don't look like such a fool on so many things.

serb01

01-12-2005, 02:31 AM

***k..battle of the moderators here..im liking this shit..and lopuza is no "young kid" hes a very intellegent man

PartizanBeograd

01-12-2005, 04:20 PM

Once again i say present, they give me a fairly tell past
"Once apon a time, in a country that no longer exists. There was a football club better than any other."

U know lets finish, tell me any European achievements that Zvezda has accomplished, since the break up of SFR Yugo
Partizans
- Made the champions league - Ended up being undefeated at home
- Made it to the spring in the Uefa cup- No other Former Yugo team has done so far

Zvezda
Correct me if im mistaken but
-nothing

BTW
The Partizan school, has turned out an amazing player, have ever heard of Simone Vukcevic, child protege(my personal opinion) . If u havent i know u will in the near future.

LopuZa

01-12-2005, 06:19 PM

<H2>Yugoslavia - List of Champions</H2>

<pre>
1923 Gradjanski Zagreb
1924 Jugoslavija Beograd
1925 Jugoslavija Beograd
1926 Gradjanski Zagreb
1927 Hajduk Split
1928 Gradjanski Zagreb
1929 Hajduk Split
1930 Concordia Zagreb
1931 BSK Beograd
1932 Concordia Zagreb
1933 BSK Beograd
1934 no championship
1935 BSK Beograd
1935/36 BSK Beograd
1936/37 Gradjanski Zagreb
1937/38 HASK Zagreb
1938/39 BSK Beograd
1939/40 Gradjanski Zagreb
1940/41 no championship
1941/42 no championship
1942/43 no championship
1943/44 no championship
1944/45 no championship
1945 Srbija [1]
1946/47 Partizan Beograd
1947/48 Dinamo Zagreb
1948/49 Partizan Beograd
1950 Hajduk Split
1951 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1952 Hajduk Split
1952/53 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1953/54 Dinamo Zagreb
1954/55 Hajduk Split
1955/56 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1956/57 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1957/58 Dinamo Zagreb
1958/59 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1959/60 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1960/61 Partizan Beograd
1961/62 Partizan Beograd
1962/63 Partizan Beograd
1963/64 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1964/65 Partizan Beograd
1965/66 Vojvodina Novi Sad
1966/67 FK Sarajevo
1967/68 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1968/69 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1969/70 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1970/71 Hajduk Split
1971/72 Zeljeznicar Sarajevo
1972/73 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1973/74 Hajduk Split
1974/75 Hajduk Split
1975/76 Partizan Beograd
1976/77 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1977/78 Partizan Beograd
1978/79 Hajduk Split
1979/80 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1980/81 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1981/82 Dinamo Zagreb
1982/83 Partizan Beograd
1983/84 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1984/85 FK Sarajevo
1985/86 Partizan Beograd [2]
1986/87 Partizan Beograd [3]
1987/88 Crvena zvezda Beograd
1988/89 Vojvodina Novi Sad
<a href="joeg90.html">1989/90</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg91.html">1990/91</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg92.html">1991/92</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd [4]
<a href="joeg93.html">1992/93</a> Partizan Beograd
<a href="joeg94.html">1993/94</a> Partizan Beograd
<a href="joeg95.html">1994/95</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg96.html">1995/96</a> Partizan Beograd
<a href="joeg97.html">1996/97</a> Partizan Beograd
<a href="joeg98.html">1997/98</a> FK Obilic
<a href="joeg99.html">1998/99</a> Partizan Beograd [5]
<a href="joeg00.html">1999/00</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg01.html">2000/01</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg02.html">2001/02</a> Partizan Beograd
Serbia and Montenegro (since February 2003)
<a href="joeg03.html">2002/03</a> Partizan Beograd
<a href="joeg04.html">2003/04</a> Crvena zvezda Beograd
<a href="joeg05.html">2004/05</a>

Top Champions

23 Crvena zvezda Beograd

18 Partizan Beograd

9 Hajduk Split

5 BSK Beograd
Gradjanski Zagreb

4 Dinamo Zagreb

2 Concordia Zagreb
Jugoslavija Beograd
FK Sarajevo
Vojvodina Novi Sad

1 FK Obilic
HASK Zagreb
Zeljeznicar Sarajevo

Notes

[1] This was a championship between representations of the 6 republics,
the Yugoslav Army, and a representation of the autonomous province
Vojvodina.

[2] The Yugoslav FA decided that the last round of fixtures had to be
replayed, after accusations that certain results had been fixed.
Partizan, who had won the title with a 4-0 over Zeljeznicar Sarajevo,
refused, after which the game was awarded 3-0 to Zeljeznicar, which
gave Crvena zvezda the title. Crvena zvezda played in the 1986/87
European Champions Cup. However, after a sequence of legal processes,
the original final table, with Partizan as champions, was officially
recognized, in 1987.

[3] Ten clubs had started the 1986/87 season with a deduction of 6 points,
among them Partizan and Crvena zvezda, because of the events in the
previous season. Vardar Skopje, who had not been deducted 6 points, won
the title, and participated in the 1987/88 Champions Cup, but the points
deduction was later annulled after more legal proceedings, and the title
was given to Partizan, who headed the table with the deduction.

[4] Before the start of the season, the Croatian clubs (Dinamo Zagreb, later
renamed to Gradjanski, Hajduk Split, NK Osijek, NK Rijeka, and NK Zagreb)
and Olimpija Ljubljana (Slovenia) withdrew and started to play in the
1991/92 championship of <A HREF="../tablesk/kroa92.html">Croatia</A> and <A HREF="../tabless/slov92.html">Slovenia</A>. During the season, the
clubs from Bosnia-Hercegovina were not able to continue playing; this
concerned FK Sarajevo, Sloboda Tuzla, Velez Mostar, and Zeljeznicar
Sarajevo; Borac Banja Luka finished the season and were relocated to
Beograd in 1992/93. After the season, Vardar Skopje and Pelister
Bitola withdrew to play in the championship of <A HREF="../tablesf/fyrom93.html">Macedonia</A>.

[5] Season interrupted on May 12 due to the NATO attack on Yugoslavia, when
there were 10 more rounds left to play; Partizan were declared champions
on Jun 13, 1999.

</PRE>
<HR>
<A NAME="about"><H2>About this document</H2></A>
Prepared and maintained by Karel Stokkermans for the
<A HREF="../nersssf.html">
Rec.Sport.Soccer Statistics Foundation</A>

Author: Karel Stokkermans 
Last updated: 8 Aug 2004 

(C) Copyright Karel Stokkermans and RSSSF 1996/2004 
You are free to copy this document in whole or part provided that proper
acknowledgement is given to the author. All rights reserved.

PartizanBeograd

01-12-2005, 07:26 PM

omg are u just dumb, or plain stupied, i said present, why on earth are u giving me a list of past champions will. I said European cups and u give me Yugoslav cups.

serb01

01-13-2005, 01:03 AM

dumb***k..he was sending that in relation to PFC's comment that no championships were rigged and that no title was ever taken away from partizan u fool..listen to the topic bre..

yes iv heard of simon vukcevic..and i knwo all about him and how hes meant to be some child prodigy..i saw him play at the olympic games and he was shittt! he either had a shit tournament or is just actually shit..when he leaves partizan for a european club and does well in a DECENT european league then i will acknowlage his achievements..

Red Star just missed out on the group stages of the uefa cup this yr as u grobari pointed out earlier losing 4-0 and 2-1 to zenit

Red Star made it to the 2nd round in the uefa cup in 03-04 but lost to rosenborg 0-1 on agg

Red Star made it to the 3rd round of the uefa cup in 02-03 and lost to lazio 1-2 as did partizan to slavia prague 1-5 :smallpig:

Red Star made it to the final qualifying round of the champions league in 01/02 where they drew 0-0 in belgrade but lost 0-3 away to laverkusen who were evential finalists in the tournament

Red Star made it to the final final qualifying round of the champions league in 00/01 but lost to dynamo kiev on away goals after both legs had finished 1-1 on agg in which we qualified for the first round of the uefa cup VVVV

Red Star made the Second round once again in 00/01 in the uefa cup but were knocked out by celta vigo 4-5 on agg...partizan were knocked out in the first round by porto

Red Star again made the second round of the uefa cup in 98-99 which could be said as the Third round as there were 2 qualifying rounds in the tournament this time

so dont say that red star hasnt done anything which infact we have done well in europe on a more consistant basis than partizan who have had mixed results since the break up of YU

PartizanBeograd

01-13-2005, 04:31 PM

yes iv heard of simon vukcevic..and i knwo all about him and how hes meant to be some child prodigy..i saw him play at the olympic games and he was shittt! he either had a shit tournament or is just actually shit..when he leaves partizan for a european club and does well in a DECENT european league then i will acknowlage his achievements..

-Dont u know that he was part of the runner up winning team at the U-21 games, last yr being the youngest players and scoring 1 goals vs Italy

Red Star just missed out on the group stages of the uefa cup this yr as u grobari pointed out earlier losing 4-0 and 2-1 to zenit

-Thats not "just missed" its "Humiliated out"

Red Star made it to the 2nd round in the uefa cup in 03-04 but lost to rosenborg 0-1 on agg
-Second Round is not a big thing, all the shit teams get eleminated in the first and second round

Red Star made it to the 3rd round of the uefa cup in 02-03 and lost to lazio 1-2 as did partizan to slavia prague 1-5 :smallpig:
It wasent the 3rd round it was again the second. And Partizan lost 6-4 after extra time.

Red Star made it to the final qualifying round of the champions league in 01/02 where they drew 0-0 in belgrade but lost 0-3 away to laverkusen who were evential finalists in the tournament
-Thats good, but again i said today, not 14 yrs ago. Also known as "present"

Red Star made it to the final final qualifying round of the champions league in 00/01 but lost to dynamo kiev on away goals after both legs had finished 1-1 on agg in which we qualified for the first round of the uefa cup VVVV

Red Star made the Second round once again in 00/01 in the uefa cup but were knocked out by celta vigo 4-5 on agg...partizan were knocked out in the first round by porto
-Second Round, Nothing big

Red Star again made the second round of the uefa cup in 98-99 which could be said as the Third round as there were 2 qualifying rounds in the tournament this time
-Second Round, Nothing big

so dont say that red star hasnt done anything which infact we have done well in europe on a more consistant basis than partizan who have had mixed results since the break up of YU[/QUOTE]
-Hay learn your history before, you post. U are only embarrassing your self

LopuZa

01-13-2005, 07:42 PM

Ok, one by one now I'll answer to your above "post".. Make sure to have a pen and paper close to you because this is the only time I'll be giving you lessons for free.

You couldn’t even tie your shoe, wipe your nose and you already think you can give someone lessons. You are going to need to eat more beans, well and get a better education before you can achieve that stature, but nice try dough.

No, we are not playing games it's just that you had no clue what you were saying. We were discussing the post-Ex. Yu period and your list was therefore wrong because it included two years which happened with the OLD COUNTRY. It' quite simple, you were wrong and I corrected you. If anything you were twisting info to suit your non existent points.

I know exactly what I am talking about. I also know what you are trying to talk about, and what you are talking about is a time slice 1992/93 to 2005. We were discussing Crvena Zvezda’s record in a period of time you picked to compare your helpless Partizan, the only period of time that you can make some kind of comparison that is not embarrassing to Partizan, I do not blame you for that…little kids do that once in a while take things out of context, basic mistake. When one compares achievement or greatness of two clubs one needs to examine all the data available all their records, not be subjective with the data to show that one club is better then the other in a time period of 13 years, as you and PartizanBeograd have tried to do. Justification for this was that ex-Yugoslavia no longer exists and the new country SCG now exists and we need to exclude the record and achievement from that period, because PFC and PartizanBeograd wants it that way, and that is the only way that their club Partizan can show slight edge in the title competition. You need to understand one basic concept while countries may have changed the club has never changed, and its records can’t be wiped out just because it achieved those records in that country that no longer exists, the club still exists, albeit in a different country. There are many examples of this in clubs from area of ex-Yugoslavia, like BSK now know as OFK Beograd, it existed in Serbia, then The Kingdom of Serbs Slovenes and Croats, then in Yugoslavia (SFRJ), then in Yugoslavia (FRJ) and finally in SCG etc.

This just shows again how little you know. Buddy, you don't even know the amount of titles you club has, yet you are vigirously arguing with me here. Let me help you, it's 25 not 28.

If your club would have won as many titles as Crvena Zvezda it would be hard for you to keep track of all those titles, unfortunately your club Partizan has not won that many titles. You can easily see from the link below how many titles Crvena Zvezda won, and I had a hard time counting since all the titles won by Crvena Zvezda do not fit on one web page, I made a simple counting mistake, no problem. You vigorously argued with me that Crvena Zvezda won 25 titles, no let me help you, that is incorrect, Crvena Zvezda won 23 titles, not 25 as you argued or shot from the hip, you are wrong. Suggestion to you is why don’t you post Partisans records vs., Zvezda’s records, titles everything and lets have a vote on which club is better.

http://www.rsssf.com/tablesj/joegchamp.html

Who the heck am I arguing with here when then don't even know such basic data. I never took away from RS's history and I believe I said it's bigger, however at the same time you can not only depend on history and not care about the present at all.. I would much rather be fan of a club that is winning today and doing well in Europe as opposed to one that died in 1991. Besides, what do you have of RS's success from 40-50 years ago? I have a feeling that you were born in the generation of people which started following matches in the mid 90's. Let me bring up Zenit again as an example, a club with almost NO history, however beat you on aggregate 6-1. Tell me, what do you have of this history then?

You are arguing with me, and I know and I will show that you are wrong about the basic data, it turns out that the basic data is not so basic after all. You took away from Crvena Zvezda’s past by limiting it to a time period that suited your argument (1992/93-2005). Why, I am not sure that you really thought about it, it was a way to get into an argument for the sake of arguing.

I prefer to be a fan of Crvena Zvezda, no mater how they did in the past or how they are doing currently I except the wins as well as the loses, part of the game, I am an adult, not a little sniveling boy. The idea that Crvena Zvezda is dead is news to me; they are currently 2nd in the 1st league table and are defending champions.

You are a laugh, what do I have from Crvena Zvezda’s success from 45-50 years ago? Well that is part of my clubs history, I can’t exclude it, it is heritage. Let’s just say that I started to follow Crvena Zvezda since I was old enough to understand the game, and that would be just a little before 1990’s. Wining and losing is part of the game, part history, one can’t be a fan of club and always expect it to win.

Now, let me just bring up that Partizan got whopped by Croatia Zagreb…5-0, what did you gain from that history?

A club that has gone silent for 15 years and done nothing on an international stage since then CANNOT be labelled as great. Real Madrid, Man UTD, Bayern etc. these are great clubs because they are consistent and always good. You on the otherhand are a one hit wonder, just like Nottingham Forest you had your 2 minutes of fame and now who knows when you'll be important again. That my friend is what separates GREAT clubs from just average, ordinary ones.

What are you talking about, silent, there was a civil war that tore apart a beautiful country and most likely prevented Crvena Zvezda from repeating its feat of 1991/92. The best players were sold, or were allowed to play in foreign clubs, Savicevic, Belodadic, Mihajlovic, Yugovic, etc. It was not just Crvena Zvezda that went silent as you say, economy in the countries surrounding former Yugoslavia were doing bad as well, most clubs from those countries did not fair any better. Bottom line the civil war did not help any, but Crvena Zvezda survived, that’s all that matters. We shell see who is the better club in March, Partizan or Crvena Zvezda, I will let the play on the field be the judge.

Sure Manchester United, Real Madrid, and the rest of Western European clubs did well and are doing well, gee but they were not involved in a civil war they were not part of a communist country with a bad economy, those are factors one must look at when comparing greatness of clubs.

As for one hit wonder, yes that may be right about Crvena Zvezda but Partizan never got the one hit, I wonder why? First of all clubs are great, some more then the others, but average clubs never won what Crvena Zvezda won, European Champions' Cup as well as well as Intercontinental "Toyota Cup", so obviously Crvena Zvezda is not an average club, on the other hand Partizan is an average club, since it never achieved what those great clubs achieved.

You are a naive little kid that does not understand how the real world works, you need to grow up, stop living with daddy and start relaying on your own achievements.

By the way, again you make a false statement. Red Star did not do it with "all" domestic players, such a statement is ridicilous. They did it with Croatian, Macedonian, Romanian etc. players along with Serbian. Yes, the Serbian players were the majority, but players like Prosinekci, Pancev, Belodedici among other non-Serbian players, all played a heavy role in RS's success in 1991.

Let me try to enlighten you since obviously your education failed you miserably. Here is where you show your lack of understanding, in 1991/92 Yugoslavia (SFRJ) Croats, Serbs, Macedonians, Slovenians and Bosnians were all considered domestic players. On the other hand Ethiopians, Nigerians, Italians, etc., are not considered domestic players. Since Crvena Zvezda played while Yugoslavia (SFRJ) existed, the players that played for Crvena Zvezda were considered domestic players. What false statement, what ridicules statement? Do you understand that little boy? So now you see how ignorant you sound, and some what bitter, and very much jealous. One just needs to read the above drivel and understand what an ignoramus you really are.

This is where I dozed of, what exactly were you trying to say? Do try harder next time please, and maybe you'll actually make some sense.

Of course you dozed of little boy, it’s your nap time; mommy will tuck you in soon. You brought up the fact that Crvena Zvezda is bankrupt, I responded to explain that it was not, and if it was that has nothing to do with its achievements.

Again I fell asleep reading this as well. You just keep making one flawed statement after another. First of all, you can not even compare Partizan's handling of the club with that of Red Star's. Partizan has for the most part held intact it's squad during the last number of years while RS is changing whenever possible. Partizan also have Teleoptik, a top class training facility among the best in Europe. Partizan have invested in the foreign market and signed players from abroad which ended up doing more than just good (Boya, Emeghara etc.).. Partizan's youth school has developed unbelievably in these last few years and beats your young team just about every time. Now my friend, Red Star have
NONE of those things I listed. By the way, i just love your first sentence, if your club is not bankrupt then tell me why does your only source of revenue come from selling players? Do you realize what you said? Also, RS didn't sell any players? What the heck are you smoking man? YOU SOLD YOUR TWO BEST PLAYERS IN VIDIC AND MLADENOVIC! Again I have to correct you.

First of all, what flawed statement, tell me about it? I am not impressed with Partizan’s youth development facility, I don’t care that they invested in foreign players, Crvena Zvezda invested and brought in foreign player before any other club in SCG, so don’t even go there since it is very obvious you do not know what you are talking about. Our youth team won a lot of trophies so I am confused how is it that Partizan beats Crvena Zvezda all the time, post the scores outcomes, let us all see this miracle.

As for the players that Crvena Zvezda sold, Vidic and Mladenovic that was year ago…that is why the coach at that time Slavoljub Muslin resigned. That is why Zvezda lost to Zenit. That is water under bridge or as they say history, we have plenty of great young players left for March meeting. Oh and BTW Partizan sold just as many players as Crvena Zvezda, check your record before you shoot from the hip.

No, we have established that you're a stubborn young kid that has very little idea of what they are saying. I posted the only ranking which matters, the only ranking that is USED BY UEFA. All other tables (like the one you listed) are useless since they are officially not used or recognized by UEFA, the clubs, associations etc. Do you understand now?

First of all I am hardly stubborn little kid, I could easily be your daddy, but if I were your daddy I would whoop you. What we have established is that you don’t have a clue. I think I know more about how UEFA ranking works then you do, but hey if you think know it better, it is ok with me I got a feeling that is only in your head that you think you know better.

All time tables are exactly that, top performing clubs in the last 50 years, up to today. It measures a clubs overall greatness, hardly useless.

Yes, fixing games was brought up this year.. but it involved Red Star as well, not just Partizan. In fact Red Star was PUBLICLY attacked by some heads in FSSCG while Partizan was more-or-less brought up through random rumours about a ref's decision on a penalty call. Interestingly, in that same match a sure penalty was not given to Partizan, so much for us rigging matches. Also, for the 100th time, you're wrong on something. No title was ever taken away from RS, it was taken away from Vardar in '87 and given justily to Partizan. Don't talk about things you don't know.

No, fixing of games this year involved Partizan and the other club that accused it of cheating…Crvena Zvezda was not involved. FSSCG did not have anything to say about Crvena Zvezda. Partizan was allegedly accused by the other club’s coach for paying the officials to give them the penalty.

Now as for 19987 a lot of clubs got accused of fixing games, Crvena Zvezda was not found to be guilty of such behavior, FSSJ at that time wanted those clubns it thought were fixing to replay last few games Partizan refused Crvena Zvezda who was second in the table was awarded the title, which was later given back to Partizan, since the communists wanted Partizan to win, it was their favorite club. See the link below or my post #23, it will clue you in on one just occasion of Partizan trying to fix outcomes of the games. I will post articles when I get some time to show you that you are wrong and that Partizan has a history of trying to fix games.

http://www.rsssf.com/tablesj/joegchamp.html

No, PFC does not know everything. But I sure as hell know more than you, that much I think I have proven..

No, I have to agree PFC does not know anything, and I sure as hell let you prove that all by your self that you really don’t know anything.

serb01

01-14-2005, 12:54 AM

yes iv heard of simon vukcevic..and i knwo all about him and how hes meant to be some child prodigy..i saw him play at the olympic games and he was shittt! he either had a shit tournament or is just actually shit..when he leaves partizan for a european club and does well in a DECENT european league then i will acknowlage his achievements..

-Dont u know that he was part of the runner up winning team at the U-21 games, last yr being the youngest players and scoring 1 goals vs Italy

Red Star just missed out on the group stages of the uefa cup this yr as u grobari pointed out earlier losing 4-0 and 2-1 to zenit

-Thats not "just missed" its "Humiliated out"

Red Star made it to the 2nd round in the uefa cup in 03-04 but lost to rosenborg 0-1 on agg
-Second Round is not a big thing, all the shit teams get eleminated in the first and second round

Red Star made it to the 3rd round of the uefa cup in 02-03 and lost to lazio 1-2 as did partizan to slavia prague 1-5 :smallpig:
It wasent the 3rd round it was again the second. And Partizan lost 6-4 after extra time.

Red Star made it to the final qualifying round of the champions league in 01/02 where they drew 0-0 in belgrade but lost 0-3 away to laverkusen who were evential finalists in the tournament
-Thats good, but again i said today, not 14 yrs ago. Also known as "present"

Red Star made it to the final final qualifying round of the champions league in 00/01 but lost to dynamo kiev on away goals after both legs had finished 1-1 on agg in which we qualified for the first round of the uefa cup VVVV

Red Star made the Second round once again in 00/01 in the uefa cup but were knocked out by celta vigo 4-5 on agg...partizan were knocked out in the first round by porto
-Second Round, Nothing big

Red Star again made the second round of the uefa cup in 98-99 which could be said as the Third round as there were 2 qualifying rounds in the tournament this time
-Second Round, Nothing big

so dont say that red star hasnt done anything which infact we have done well in europe on a more consistant basis than partizan who have had mixed results since the break up of YU
-Hay learn your history before, you post. U are only embarrassing your self[/QUOTE]

u dumbshit go to ***king www.uefa.com and check out the all time stats u dumb shit..everything i said was CORRECT 3rd round and so on im not embarrassing myself here u fool u r..coz u cant hack shit..im saying we r a consistant team so shut up man..***k since u came in here uv started shit :ronaldo:

serb01

01-14-2005, 01:05 AM

end of discussion lopuza shat all over u PFC :smallpig: :smallpig: :smallpig:

PartizanBeograd

01-14-2005, 02:04 AM

where do u think i got the info, fool?
Go to Uefa cup all time stats

And if u look at Champions Leage, u will see that Partizan made it last yr :p

serb01

01-14-2005, 12:01 PM

just shut the ***k up man..lopuza explains to u again and again but u seem 2 change shit around so that it suits u..look at the uefa stats and all my shit is right thats where i got it from so shut up.. :smallpig: :smallpig: :smallpig: :smallpig: jebo vam pas mater grobari :bloody:

LopuZa

01-14-2005, 03:25 PM

omg are u just dumb, or plain stupied, i said present, why on earth are u giving me a list of past champions will. I said European cups and u give me Yugoslav cups.

The way I see when one wants to compare greatness of two clubs one must post all their records, which would include past as well as present. What I like to know what is your big objection to Crvena Zvezda’s complete record of title runs? Why is it that you fixated on current record only?

<h3>European Champions' Cup</h3>
http://www.rsssf.com/tablese/ec1.html

<h3>UEFA Cup</h3>
http://www.rsssf.com/tablese/ec3b.html

<h3>FAQ: Qualification and Seeding for the European Cups</h3>
http://www.rsssf.com/miscellaneous/ecfaq.html

<h3> UEFA Country Coefficients 2003/2004</h3>
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/ccoef2004.html
<h3> UEFA Team Coefficients 2003/2004</h3>
<pre>
66  Partizan Belgrade  Srb CL  6   4  5.485
67  Red Star Belgrade  Srb UC  4   4  5.485
</pre>
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/tcoef2004.html

<h3> UEFA Team Ranking 2004</h3>
<pre>
96 Red Star Belgrade  Srb   2.045  6.485  2.045 5.595  5.485  21.654
113 Partizan Belgrade  Srb  1.045   2.485  3.045   6.595  5.485  18.654

</pre>
http://www.xs4all.nl/~kassiesa/bert/uefa/data/method3/trank2004.html

PartizanBeograd

01-14-2005, 05:30 PM

[QUOTE=LopuZa]The way I see when one wants to compare greatness of two clubs one must post all their records, which would include past as well as present. What I like to know what is your big objection to Crvena Zvezda’s complete record of title runs? Why is it that you fixated on current record only?

OMG i started to this forum, to talk about the two clubs revival to the World Class stats. But u ppl just kept bad mouth Partizan. I had nothing against Zvezda they are a good team and i think they are going to go far next season in the European League. But if u read my comments carefully, i never asked about how the club did in the past, I was talking about how they are doing now, because i want them BOTH to be successfull in the Eurpean League.

LopuZa

01-15-2005, 10:18 PM

<TABLE WIDTH=150 CELLPADDING=0 CELLSPACING=0 BORDER=0 ALIGN=RIGHT HSPACE=6 VSPACE=3>
<TR><TD ALIGN=CENTER>
<IMG SRC=http://www.serbia-info.com/g3/images/partizancelebrates0905jpg.jpg ALT="Players of Partizan celebrate victory over Red Star"> Players of Partizan celebrate victory over Red Star 
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Belgrade, May 9 (agencies) - Partizan Belgrade won a Yugoslav Cup final with a goal from skipper Sasa Ilic 25 minutes from the end.
Red Star dominated the first half but Partizan fought back strongly after the break and importantly they took their chance when it came in the 65th minute. Sasa Ilic took advantage of a mistake by namesake Dejan Ilic and blasted the ball into the far corner. 
Red Star top scorer, Mihajlo Pjanovic missed a number of opportunities. He got away twice early on but he shot narrowly wide from Milenko Acimovic's cross minutes after letting Partizan goalkeeper Radovan Radakovic close him down. 
Goran Drulic also had chances, but Nisa Saveljic largely kept him quiet. 

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<IMG SRC=http://www.serbia-info.com/g3/images/zoricbajic0905jpg.jpg>
 Sasa Zoric (Reed Star) jumps over Branko Bajic 
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Partizan only chance of the half came on 41 minutes, when Jeremic set up a Miladin Becanovic header. 
Just before the wining goal, Milenko Acimovic was denied by a fine save by Partizan's excellent goalkeeper. 

<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

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"We are disappointed with the defeat. I hoped that we would play better. We had more chances, but Partizan scored. That is football. The team that had more luck won and I congratulate them" (Slavoljub Muslin, Red Star coach).

"I don't remember how I received the ball. I first looked and saw Ilijev was free. Then I knew that I was alone in front of the Red Star goal. I just knew that ball was going in the net" (Sasa Ilic, scorer for Partizan).

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<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

Police and fans injured in violent Yugoslav cup final

Belgrade, May 9 (Reuters) - Six police officers and 11 fans
were injured in fighting before and during the Yugoslav cup
final between Belgrade rivals Red Star and Partizan, officials
of Belgrade's Anlave clinic said. 
"Six police officers sustained head and facial injuries from
wooden clubs, iron rods and stones before and during the match
and were taken to hospital for treatment," the clinc's manager
Slobodan Ivanovic told reporters after the match. 
"A total of 11 fans were also injured by bottles, wooden
clubs and stones and four of them have been taken to hospital,
he added. 
Rival fans fought each other and had running battles with
police shortly before the kickoff and some left the staduim
before the final whistle after tear gas was thrown into the
crowd on one of the terraces. 
It was not immediately clear who threw it.

<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

Yugoslav Cup final violence leads to 28 arrests

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<IMG SRC=http://www.serbia-info.com/g3/images/redstarfootballfansfight0905jpg.jpg>
 
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Belgrade, May 11 (Reuters) - Violent clashes before and
during Wednesday's Yugoslav Cup final between bitter Belgrade
rivals Red Star and Partizan led to 28 arrests, Serbian police
said on Friday. 
"Police took action and arrested 28 offenders in order to
prevent further riots and has pressed charges against 24 of
them," the Serbian Interior Ministry said in a written
statement. 
It added that two police and 14 private vehicles were
damaged in the rampage that started on Wednesday morning with
rival fans fighting running battles with each other and police.
Six police officers and a dozen fans were injured in the
fighting.

<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

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<IMG SRC=http://www.serbia-info.com/g3/images/footballcupenglogogif.gif>
 
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Yugoslav Football Cup final match

RED STAR Belgrade - PARTIZAN Belgrade 0-1 (0-0)

Red Star Stadium. Scorer: Sasa Ilic (65). Attendance: 30,000. Referee: Miroslav Radoman. Booked: Zoric, Ilic, Acimovic (Red Star), Duljaj, S. Ilic, Ivic, Jeremic, Becanovic and Saveljic (Partizan).

RED STAR: Kocic, Zoric, Vitakic, Lerinc (Boskovic), Lalatovic, Bunjevcevic, Gvozdenovic, Ilic (Markovic), Drulic, Acimovic, Pjanovic.

PARTIZAN: Radakovic, Rasovic, Jeremic, Saveljic, Bajic, Duljaj, Trobok, Ivic, Ilic, Becanovic, Iliev (Delibasic).

<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

<h2>Winners of the national cup of the FR Yugoslavia</h2>

1992 - PARTIZAN Belgrade
 1993 - RED STAR Belgrade
 1994 - PARTIZAN Belgrade
 1995 - RED STAR Belgrade
 1996 - RED STAR Belgrade
 1997 - RED STAR Belgrade
 1998 - PARTIZAN Belgrade
 1999 - RED STAR Belgrade
 2000 - RED STAR Belgrade
 2001 - PARTIZAN Belgrade

<CENTER>*****</CENTER>

PartizanBeograd

01-18-2005, 02:46 AM

Just wondering.
All u Zvezda, etc... fans, will u be at least cheering for Partizan when they face Dnipro in Febuary?

serb01

01-19-2005, 06:59 AM

doubt it..hope they lose otherwise u guys will get all up urselves again..my heart stays with zvezda y would i want the team i hate to go further?

PartizanBeograd

01-19-2005, 09:38 PM

When they teams play in the European Tournaments, u should always cheer for the Serbian teams/players.
But in the domestic league, its free for all

Thats why i was cheering for Zvezda when the were playing the qualifying games. Ive seen 3 qualifying games, 2-2, 3-0(young boys), 3-2(PSV), i was really impressed by the way they played against young boys (especially in the second game). The PSV game, all though they did win it 3-2, the second half they could of improved tons, the ball was almost always at the Zvezda Half, except the Pantelic counter attack goal(which was amazing).

Marko_c

01-20-2005, 12:28 AM

yes he's right.....i always cheer for the serbian side if they're compeating in europe......it brings more and more quality to our league the more and more teams play in europe